Sisters! Unite!

[Sekon]

You know what? There's been a series of post's on the net recently that myself and a few other women have found very offensive. One was the subjects of moontimes, the other recommended a book how Iroquois women "should" act. And, now, one about Ojibwe women begging for "Mohawk" male lovers. It's been a real bar-type, guy lovefest mentality.

Look, I'm proud to be a strong Haudenosaunee woman and make no apologies for standing up for myself and speaking my mind. That's a bunch of junk being passed around how Iroquois women should act and trying to silence the Haudenosaunee women that have strong voices. Because that's what being a Haudenosaunee women is all about, having strong minds, hearts, and the courage to act upon our convictions, regardless of popular pop culture opinions on how Indian women should act. Well, if you don't like it, go find some geisha wannabe or a blow-up doll that doesn't talk back.

Remember, a strong man isn't threatened by a strong woman.

~Sekon~

[Blackbear]

My first thoughts on how we should act are this.
If I am home taking care of the kids, keepign up the house, doing the laundry, making good hot meals, taking care of the bills and keeping doctor appointments.. I am acting as I should.. but now if the roles are reversed and I'm the one going out and bringing home the bacon..I'm still acting as I should.
If we as iroquois women are seen as equals by our men, then our men should not be telling us how we should act. Especially if they are not the one's married to us or if they are not our fathers.

[Tsi Nikayen' Enonhne']

She:kon!

Ok so you have told the world how strong and dependable you are. You have stood up for the strong voice and managed to convince a few of the lurkers that you are all to be highly respected.

I'm glad to see this trait demonstrated so well.....so when will my supper be ready? Get to it already!

:hehehmn:

O:nen

[Sekon]

She:kon!

Ok so you have told the world how strong and dependable you are. You have stood up for the strong voice and managed to convince a few of the lurkers that you are all to be highly respected.

I'm glad to see this trait demonstrated so well.....so when will my supper be ready? Get to it already!

:hehehmn:

O:nen

Hey, I don't mind cooking, as long as you do the dishes. Deal?

I convinced a few lurkers of something??? ALRIGHT!!! :banana::banana::banana:

[Blackbear]

Lurkers??? ROFLMAO!!! I got no clue when your supper be ready... dinner here was taco bell tonight and I'm the one that stepped and fetched cause it was my decision to eat taco hell hehehehehe! Also it gets me out of dishes. Hubby said it was the best meal he ever ate! Of course he says that anytime he does'nt have to cook. ROFLMAO

[Blackbear]

sorry I had to edit..my grammer really sucks some times and thought I better add to it and let it make some sense LOL

[Craig]

Well, If the Great Law has any meaning then:
1 The Woman pick the Chief's and can remove them.
2 The Woman control the land and all other property.

There are just a few more however I think those two will suffice for now. ;)

Maybe the Men making all these macho comments should take a look at just how traditional they really want to be. It sounds like they only follow those things they want to and then only when it fits into there way of thinking. :conf


Craig
humming Macho Macho Man Ha Ha Ha Ha. :king

[Blackbear]

Well I think most men who tell a woman how she should act is based on how they want to see a woman act... how it suits them or appeals to them. The way a woman acts regardless of bad or good to you, is HOW A WOMAN ACTS.. I mean if a man wants a stereotypical woman the drag queens have that down pat and in spades. They are the old fashioned kinda gal you hear about. ROFLMAO

[nyeh neh noos]

Well...based on recent experience...AND past experience, Indian men tend to be threatened by strong women. It's too bad that independence and strength isn't viewed more highly. Then again, there are those native men who LOVE to have their women take care of them. Where's the balance in it all????? Sheeshh.... :crybaby:

[D-liz]

:hmmm:.................

well I have to say ladies that i don't think that this discussion restricts itself to iroquois women/ indian men ! I feel that men generally appear to be threatened by strong, independent women. Do you think that we ourselves are responsible for that? I'm probably thinking of a time before most of you here the, 'burn your bra' phase, did we, in our search for 'equality in all things' erase the line between being equal to, and emasculating men? Or is my western indoctrination maybe coming through here TNE? Guess I'm just saying i think we confused some of the buggers!



in a soggy, soggy hole in the uk, after opening my big mouth to Craig (I said we had sunshine! Ha Ha!) Liz

[Blackbear]

yeah but... the burning of bras.. I think it was the men that encouraged that... ROFLMAO

[Jcmc]

And it was them who invented it too!
Jcmc

[Blackbear]

I know!! What's up with that? Invent something to keep them from falling to our knees with age, but then prefer us without them???? OY!

[Blackbear]

I decided this conversation is better to be had in the card club so I moved it.

You know though..I hate generalizing all men. There are some very good one's in the world and I've actually met quite a few.
Do not get me wrong, I am NOT a feminist by any means. Even though I should be looked at as an equal, that I agree with, I do like to be spoiled occasionally (ok more often than not, but that's his choice) and I LOVE to be the one spoiling!
I have no problems with women in the so called "traditional roles". A woman who stays at home and raises the kid still is one of the most honorable professions in the world and every one of them should be paid for it I think. A woman who can work 8 hours a day and still manage to run her home should have her toes kissed daily!!! I mean, that's the ultimate in multitasking!!!
I mean, is it any wonder that the most desirable man is the one that helps out around the house and watches the kids when needed or asked?

[Bubs]

I find this a little funny threatened and emasculating men. First off I could see it off the rez because I have met very few non-natives who even except women as equal. They will say women are equal in front of women but thier actions speak other wise. But within a rez if my wife pisses me off I have traditional methods of dealing with this. You either go and visit her Clan mother or her Aunts, it will cost you some manual labor of some sort or a favor just to get the talking time. And you talk about your problems with the older women, if they feel you are wrong they will tell you no problem your thinking wrong or talk to my wife. Then if I'm right the older women will talk with my wife, then she gets pissed at me for talking and taddilling but she will listen to her elders just not me Ha! Ha!. It is one of the reasons we have Clan mothers to keep strong families. I guess you could call it a mediator. But also things are considerably different living on a rez. When hunting season or fishing season comes I will not ask to go hunting or fishing it is my right just as it my wife's right to attend womens meeting, beading circles. We also have snow snake game's that women are not suppose to attend. It is the mans responcebility to do everything his wife girlfriend needs done so when your ride to the game comes everyone is happy. If your fighting when your ride arrives they will leave you behind, it's bad luck. Also if women shows up at a game men can't consintrate on the game, throwers can't hit the thrath, everyone starts asking if she is single half the guys minds leave the game.
But my wife owns the property I will build a house on I purchased it for her, it's been this way for ever as far as I know. But I also understand if I leave her for what ever reason or she kicks me out for being lazy my children still have a place to live and call home. It's not like that off the rez, they have shelters off the rez. I married my wife not to walk in front of me and not to walk behind me but beside me through life. I left the rez only to server in the military as a paratrooper and a special forces solider and for some reason I do not feel threatened or emasculated with my Haudenosaunee woman. I'm not saying we don't have sever disagreements at times because we do I just assume it's part of life. I also know enough not to put my head on the chopping block because she would chop it off, just for being dumb.

[D-liz]

hiya Bubs,
I will probably feel really stupid asking this (put it down to not having a man around the house!) but where/ who does your wife go to when you piss her off? :uplaugh: I have my own theory here about women , I reckon we either stand in front of our mens faces and say" you really pissed me off" which if we were cutting meat at the time promotes the 's*** run like hell' attidude, or we suppress it all till we blow our stacks and then it's the elephant syndrome.....hubby..."i did not say that" ...wife .."oh yes you did, 3 years 5 months 22 days and 2/12 hours ago" !!!!!

While I've got you here Bubs (this has nothing to do with the topic really) but I have to say I don't think you would like to try this out. I was watching a cookery programme over here a week or so ago and it reminded me of what you were saying about your grandad eating everything of an animal, the chef (Kieth Floyd his name is) was in madagascar and he showed someone making a local dish a madagascan stew...they used zebu cattle meat, well specifically male zebu, if i tell you that over here in the west it would be AKA 'Lorena Bobbitt Stew' you can guess why it has to be a male zebu !!! ok so you get your 'bobbitt' and cut it into bitesized pieces, simmer for 24 hours!then add carrots, crushed greens, and to add a little piquant flavour 2-3 sprigs of....cannabis( I kid ye not!):banana:,few slurps of that gravy guess you wouldn't care which bit of the zebu was going down! a word of warning for the ladies here, if you are thinking of making this for your man, if you are substituting bull for the zebu 1) make sure it's dead before you start cutting into bitesize pieces, that heavy breathing in your ear might not be your man and 2) make sure it's the bull you got a hold of!

take care Liz

[Blackbear]

Roflmao!!!!!! That"s Too Dang Funny!!!!!!!

[Bubs]

D-liz, my wife has the same options, she can go to my Clan mother or my Aunts and talk about what I do that pisses her off. And in the same fashion she might bring over something she has cooked to share with them or maybe fix some sewing thing for them and sit and talk with my Clan mother or Aunts or elder woman of the Deer clan. And they would either tell her she is thinking wrong or come tell me something needs to change. I guess it's kind of embarrassing to be told by your elders that you are doing something that breaks the harmony of your home. But it lets you know your community cares, it not just the two of us squabbling because others know.
I also seen a cooking show were they cook the bulls organ (to be polite).
I think I might pass on that little dish, somebody might ask me what I ate and I would have make a choice lie or tell the truth. I normally would try any food once I guess I do have limits now that you mentioned bull dinner. I need to look for a email I got a little while ago, it had a blood sausage that Cree Indians made from caribou blood. From what I'm understanding why most cultures had some form of blood sausage is for the high protien content.